The Fancy Bastard Forum

Well the classic saying "If it bleeds, it leads" seems pretty appropriate here. Throw in the governments knee jerk reaction and ofcourse this sorry situation will get more coverage than it deserves. Gaming is this generations comics, TV or rock n roll, the older generation don't understand it so it must be evil. This situation from my perspective has very little to do with gaming and much more to do with piss poor parenting.
Much like the story from a few months back where a boy was playing to much Call of Duty and his father took his xbox away, the boy ran away and was found dead a week later. Guess what, parents still blamed the game god forbid they get of their lazy ass and do some actual parenting. Can videogames be addictive, absolutely if you're the kind of person with an addictive personality. If their kid was hooked on cigarettes or drugs would they just take them away and expect him to go cold turkey?
The media likes to beat up on videogames because they won't fight back, and if someone does come out in support of videogames they are dismissed as a rabid fun or just plain crazy. Take how Geoff Keighley was treated on Fox news during the whole Mass Effect "sexbox" debacle. He got less airtime than someone who'd not seen a single frame of the game (Though the reaction from the videogame community was worth a million bucks of funny.)
Honestly, i throw videogames into the pile with gay marriage, net neutrality and a whole bunch of other things. They won't be treated fairly until the generation that grew up with them is in power so it's best just to ignore the BS and make your own decisions till then.
Sorry for the rant, this is one of those subjects that really angrys up my blood.

Posted By: Ferros
Much like the story from a few months back where a boy was playing to much Call of Duty and his father took his xbox away, the boy ran away and was found dead a week later. Guess what, parents still blamed the game god forbid they get of their lazy ass and do some actual parenting. Can videogames be addictive, absolutely if you're the kind of person with an addictive personality. If their kid was hooked on cigarettes or drugs would they just take them away and expect him to go cold turkey?

I'm not sure I want to do the gamer kneejerk equivalent of blame the parents. Yes, it's probably wrong to blame video games too, but at the same time, every parent has had a child threaten to run away. It's not stupid parenting, just a tragedy with misplaced rage.

Posted By: YtoabnAlso, the games they are addicted to tend to be PC based MMORPGs or just MMOs in general. Is there something specific about that type of game that leads to addiction (perhaps the community)?Since none of you can pronounce my name (Why-tow-a-bin), why don't you just call me YT.

I think that's more of a geographic artifact. These stories have come largely from East Asian countries lately, where MMOs enjoy much much more popularity in general. My limited understanding is that MMOs are often the functional equivalent of social networking sites in those countries, so taking away access would be akin to taking away the ability to talk to your friends. Like Ferros said, gaming is in this case just a proxy for anything that serves as a generational gap. The parent takes it away because he needs it to be something significant and he knows his child likes it, but he doesn't really understand what it is that he's taking away. The child laments that his parents don't understand him and overreacts, as children often do. It's a scenario that could be playing out in millions of households around the world every day. Things probably should have been handled differently, but that's damned easy to say with the benefit of hindsight.

I do think the closing of all gaming sites by the Thai government is a gross overreaction. It's not unusual for Southeast Asian governments to play a significant role in disciplining children, one which is often considered harsh to Western eyes. That's a cultural gap, and I recognize that. Frankly, though, I think even Western governments have been overstepping their bounds in the past decade when it comes to parenting. I don't like the tendency of modern governments toward surveillance states, and I don't like government hovering over parents' shoulders. As such I find the article very disturbing, but only because of actions of the heads of state. The father and son were in the middle of what turned out to be a very unfortunate situation, nothing more.

Posted By: Ytoabn

Posted By: Ferros
Much like the story from a few months back where a boy was playing to much Call of Duty and his father took his xbox away, the boy ran away and was found dead a week later. Guess what, parents still blamed the game god forbid they get of their lazy ass and do some actual parenting. Can videogames be addictive, absolutely if you're the kind of person with an addictive personality. If their kid was hooked on cigarettes or drugs would they just take them away and expect him to go cold turkey?

I'm not sure I want to do the gamer kneejerk equivalent of blame the parents. Yes, it's probably wrong to blame video games too, but at the same time, every parent has had a child threaten to run away. It's not stupid parenting, just a tragedy with misplaced rage.Since none of you can pronounce my name (Why-tow-a-bin), why don't you just call me YT.

You know why i personally blame the parents. Rather than mourning their son and thinking about what had occured they went on TV and proclaimed "Videogames killed our son!" Everyone has issues as a teenager and feels noone accepts them, maybe the kid was a god in Call of Duty and it's the only thing that made him feel good about himself after being picked on at school all day. All of that is pure speculation on my part ofcourse but we'll never know the truth because "videogames did it!" If his parents had tried to understand him rather than punish him this all could've been avoided. To me that stinks of lazy parenting.

Posted By: FerrosYou know why i personally blame the parents. Rather than mourning their son and thinking about what had occured they went on TV and proclaimed "Videogames killed our son!" Everyone has issues as a teenager and feels noone accepts them, maybe the kid was a god in Call of Duty and it's the only thing that made him feel good about himself after being picked on at school all day. All of that is pure speculation on my part ofcourse but we'll never know the truth because "videogames did it!" If his parents had tried to understand him rather than punish him this all could've been avoided. To me that stinks of lazy parenting.Never go with a hippie to a second location.

I kind of have to agree with Ytoabn on this one. I've followed those links as deep as I could and couldn't find any indication that the parents were in any way responsible for all this media attention. Not to say that it didn't happen, or that it never happens (we all know that to be false). But I agree that jumping to the conclusion that "the parents were lazy and just want media attention" is just as counter-productive as saying "it's always those damned videogames."

I think the point here isn't that the parents are saying videogames did it, it's that the Thai government is concluding that all videogames are always bad simply because a child committed suicide (and by the way he also played games). I don't mind throwing around a little blame, but let's throw it where it really belongs.

You are completely missing my point. If it gets to the point where a teenager is in the mindset of "must game or i'll kill myself" then it's already to late. How did the parents let it get that bad? Why didn't they notice the problem sooner? Were the videogames a replacement for attention until it inconvenienced the parents? Videogames can be addictive, if they are your childs favourite pasttime then you should educate yourself about them. My four year old little sister f'ing loves Dora the Explorer. When she is in my care i let her watch one DVD and then i spend time with the TV off playing Dora with her. If i let her she'd sit like a stunned mullet in front of the TV and watch nothing but Dora for hours, but that isn't taking care of her that's being lazy. It's about being actively involved, informed and educated about what your child enjoys even if you can't stand the bloody thing.

Posted By: FerrosYou are completely missing my point.

Look, over there, by the things that aren't these! That which can be seen is interesting! Let us seek tactile contact with that which we espy and in doing so alter our location!

Posted By: FerrosYou are completely missing my point. If it gets to the point where a teenager is in the mindset of "must game or i'll kill myself" then it's already to late. How did the parents let it get that bad? Why didn't they notice the problem sooner? Were the videogames a replacement for attention until it inconvenienced the parents? Videogames can be addictive, if they are your childs favourite pasttime then you should educate yourself about them. My four year old little sister f'ing loves Dora the Explorer. When she is in my care i let her watch one DVD and then i spend time with the TV off playing Dora with her. If i let her she'd sit like a stunned mullet in front of the TV and watch nothing but Dora for hours, but that isn't taking care of her that's being lazy. It's about being actively involved, informed and educated about what your child enjoys even if you can't stand the bloody thing.Never go with a hippie to a second location.

OK I gotcha. By the same token, though, you can play a lot of videogames without being addicted, and it doesn't necessarily follow that because he played a lot of videogames that he was neglected by his parents. There are a lot of assumptions there. For example, one can read a lot of books to the point that you might call him addicted. If someone is reading books obsessively to avoid social contact, though, then book-reading is a symptom of the problem and not the problem itself. That's an important distinction.

Watching a four-year old is much different than a twelve-year old as well. A four-year old is entirely dependent on her caretakers, and requires nearly constant supervision and guidance. A twelve-year old doesn't need that level of supervision, and in fact it might be inappropriate to do so. Teenagers need to start learning to deal with some level of independence in order to develop into healthy adults. So yeah I do think as a parent you should understand what your child is doing, but that's different than hovering over them and watching their every move. Even a twelve-year old is entitled to some level of privacy.

I just don't think there's enough evidence to pass judgment on the parents. Yes, the child committed suicide. Yes, the child played a lot of videogames. I don't think either of those things necessarily means that the parents did anything wrong. We don't know anything about what their life was like, so all we can do - all we should do - is offer our sympathy for their terrible situation. Losing a child is traumatic enough without having others casting aspersions or making unfounded assumptions.

EDIT: Reading back, I think you hit the nail on the head back there. Gaming might have been his coping mechanism for something going on at school or who-knows-where. Taking it away left him without his outlet for dealing with something (maybe something he didn't particularly want to share with his family). We don't know if it was a "game or die" situation. It could have been any number of things. It could have been a psychological issue that reached a breaking point. We just don't know.